You have been reading a series of love poems over the last week, and will continue to examine them for a few more days. Consider your experience with these poems along with all your experiences with poetry.
THEN, make your argument: is poetry worth teaching in a high school English classroom?
Please consider, in your argument, the following:
- How you, your peers, and/or your teachers approach poetry
- The role poetry plays in every day life
- How poetry differs from prose, and whether that difference matters
- Experiences, good or bad, that you have had when reading or interpreting poetry
- Specific poems that you remember that contributed to those experiences
Please respond to the most interesting argument that you read on this blog, and please practice good grammar.
Also, you must consider the two texts below as part of your argument:
"Poets are expected to make sense of life. If they find life today in fragments, they must not leave it that way." -- Jayanta Mahapatra
The Questions Poems Ask
Lawrence Raab
playing around in the woods, swooping
in low after each other, I wonder
if they ever slam into the trees.
There's an answer here, unlike
most questions in poems,
which are left up in the air.
Was it a vision or a waking dream?
You decide, says the poet.
You do some of this work,
but think carefully.
Some people want to believe
poetry is anything
they happen to feel. That way
they're never wrong. Others yearn
for the difficult:
insoluble problems, secret codes
not meant to be broken.
Nobody, they've discovered,
ever means what he says.
But rarely does a crow
hit a tree, though other, clumsier birds
bang into them all the time, and we say
these birds have not adapted well
to the forest environment.
Frequently stunned, they become
easy prey for the wily fox,
who's learned how to listen
for that snapping of branches
and collapsing of wings,
who knows where to go
and what to do when he gets there.
72 comments:
From my personal opinion, I do believe poetry is worth teaching in a high school English classrooms. Whether we read or write our own poems, we gain great knowledge from them. The way we approach it differs in many way. From looking for a personal connection to the speaker and their experience, to just simply experiencing something new through someone else’s words. I think that when we read poems we look for a connection. We are needy individuals and when we can't find the support that we need physically we look for it in other ways. I feel poetry, and literature in general, allows us to find that connection. Poetry might not be something we encounter everyday but I'm most certain that when we come across it, the words move us. Without control, these words either have an immense or minor impact on us.
Poetry is a form of expression. It is imaginative, realistic, and everything else the poet chooses it to be. There is more thought put into poems than prose. The thought put into these poems contributes to their beauty and allows the audience to experience the moments through the poets eyes and feel their emotions. Every little decision the poet makes towards their poem in the structure of it or the way they verbally present it, enhances our understanding of the message they're trying to get across or simply as stated before their experience.
Just as Lawrence Raab, I believe that a poem is simply what we, the reader, make it. We apply our personal experiences to our readings and interpret the poem how we want, not as the poet intended.
From personal experiences, I find that poems that I encounter, and that are based on particular topics I can relate to get to me. They affect me emotionally and mentally. I find my self relating to the poets and am inspired. Poet’s posses the beautiful and amazing gift of allowing individuals they don't even know to find a sort of connection they most likely yearn for.
Ashley Hart...
I almost completely agree with Roro. While prose and other types of literature (short stories, novels etc.) can teach us the concepts of good grammer and give us something to think about, poetry isn't as easy to decipher and master.It takes skill, ambition, and initiative and invokes a feeling within people that typical literature cannot. Whether it be a poem we have written, or someone else's work, we are able to convey and accept feelings that we may or may not have felt before. There is a connection that lies within the line breaks and stanzas of a poem that draws us in a makes us feel what the poet is feeling. As Roro said, "we are needy individuals." We long to feel how others feel and to experiance what we have not and that is part of what draws us into poetry. By not teaching poetry in high schools, young verbalists are losing the chance to express themselves and learn a different type pf writing. Poetry allows us to connect with others without feeling awkward and to use imagination, realism, music, art and other ideas to make a point. I feel that the lack of poetry would stifle the minds of the young and old in America.
Just as Lawrence Raab, I feel that a poem is whatever we interpret it to be. Similary to Roro, I gravitate towards poems that are metally and emotionally stimulating. I connect with poetry that connects with me. Unlike the crow in the poem though, I do run into obstacles that knock me back, but I always adapt to the poetry that comes my way and eventually love it. (Unless it is a 1 on a scale from 1 to 10 with 10 being the best)
A agree with Rocio. I feel that it is necessary for poetry to be taught in a high school English classroom.
I think that poetry can be used as a method in teaching students how to analysis text. It was through poems that I learn how to to approach poetry through a different lense. Before I would read a poem and only understand its literal meaning. However after being taught literary techniques now I have come to appreciate written works. I understand that individuals write poetry not to be read once and later to be forgotten. They write so their emotions and idea can be embedded into the minds of other.Therefore, like Lawerence Raab mentioned, poetry can be written in a form of secret codes. That's why poets add allusion, colors and other literary techniques so we can look inside their minds.
Often when I write, I add phrases that I don't intend other to understand,only myself.Overall, poetry allows the appreciation of ideas to continue.
-Desiree Portalatin - 3rd Period
Although, many high school students may think poetry is stupid, pointless, or just plain boring, I believe poetry should still be thought in schools. Teaching poems helps students to learn how to analysis, express their feelings in writing, and become creative individuals. I, myself, have always complained when working with poems and trying to write my own. When I read a poem, usually, my first reaction will be, “I don’t get it”. But if I took the time to reread it and try to decipher what the poem means, I can learn to love it. However, similar to what Lawrence Raab says, my interpretation might be different from someone else's.
Like Ashley, I believe some people will prefer reading and/or writing about something they “long for”. It gives them a chance to escape reality. Unlike prose, you can use grammar in poetry however you’d like to. You can have no capitalization and no punctuations. This freedom can change the overall impact of the poem. In the end, poetry is your friend.
I also agree that poetry is worth teaching in high school English classrooms. It teaches students how different techniques are used to effect the tone and mood of a piece of text. For instance, you wouldn't see enjambment outside of poetry because standard rules apply when you are writing a novel; however, in poetry there aren't any real rules, you can compose it in anyway you believe will contribute to your message, and this is why poetry is important because there are different techniques involved. I don't think it teaches any new skills that other genres do not, but at the same time it is equally important because it helps you to analyze various techniques.
Tiffany Tsang
I must agree with everyone else that poetry is worth teaching in high school classrooms. The reason why is because this teaches us various ways to read writings with different techniques, etc. For a fact that poetry is not dead, since there are still many writers out there that are poets and the fact that many high school students are still learning from poems. The fact that we do literary analysis it gives us a way to tie back to the poem or to understand it.
I agree with Rocio. I believe that poetry is worth teaching. It is true. We are needy individuals and oftentimes we have nothing left to turn to but a book of poetry that describes exactly what we are feeling. Emotionally poetry and literature in generally is the best way to let your feeling out in a creative way, but I believe that poetry is a great way to teach people that things aren’t always handed to you. We must search deeply and work hard for the things we want to accomplish in our lives. Yes, some poetry we can right away reveal the meaning because its right on the surface. But wouldn’t you get bored being able to figure everything out extremely easily? I know I would. Some people read because its fun to find the deeper meaning in the literature. In class it is sometimes fun to analyze poems. I say sometimes because most of the time it’s really hard. But after discussing all of the possible options for meaning, it leads to some very interesting and meaningful discussions.
I believe that poetry is more important than a lot of other aspects of schoolwork that we study while we're actually in school. I believe that a lot of work we do in school like Calculus and Physics are things that we may lose sight of importance along the way. I believe that some of the biggest things in life are everyday experiences. The experience of shcool is a journey in itself. The way we look at our years of high school is a very realistic aspect of life to be educated on. Wouldn't it be nice to be told what's going to happen, these 4-5 years of school and the experiences that will happen along the way?
Well there is a class, there is a teaching, there is a way we can learn. Poetry is in some way our answer. Sometimes poetry reveals some of the things that no piece of info., or lecture, or book can help reveal, because the way in which poetry reveals a very personal, deep opinion as to what someone's feelings are on an aspect of life. Now, many would argue that this is biased because not everyone's opinion is the same, nor is it reflected in the same way in every piece of poetry. But, with this understanding and broadening of our minds we come to understand that by studying many different pieces of poetry we come to understand life and poetry and english and language and the world in ways that we may have never thought before. We can open our minds to something that academics is sometimes oblivious to, because there is no formula for what makes poetry good or valueable. There is only the way in which poetry is insightful and offers something so realistic at times other aspects of school cannot offer. It's the closest thing to a realistic feeling we can get from school. To take this out of the curriculum would be disastrous of sorts. To remove poetry from the curriculum would result in so many dull days at shcool, and such a plain outlook on the things in life. We stem so many of the main aspects of writing and language into our poetry and poetry is some of the most fine examples of great use of literary technique to be revealing we could ever hope to see. Their is some use in enigma when we think about what the use of our own soul searching can offer to us. Whether it be our contemplation of a certain writing or a way in which a writier has used diction to slow down the mood of a piece of poetry, it offers us so much.
In short, I dont believe we should remove poetry from the curriculum.
I agree with everyone that believes that poetry is worth teaching in high school classrooms. I think poetry is a great way to teach and practice the techniques that we learn such as: mood, tone, and where does the sympathy lie. I agree with ro ro that we are needy individuals that seek support, and when we can't find that support, we turn to literature. I, personally, feel a connection to poetry rather that novels or short stories.
If poetry died in high school english classrooms, I would attend its funeral.
I must say that i agree with Desiree.Lawrence Raab's "The Questions Poems Ask" basically says that some people cannot seem to find full meaning in their words, so they express them in different ways more complex so that they can really understand how they are feeling. It seems that Jayanta Mahapatra thinks the same.
Poetry is definitely crucial to a beneficial education. In a classroom setting, we approach poetry as another piece to anyalyze and make sense of. Sometimes, poetry isn't very clear. Some poets write only so that they can understand and feel more through such wonderful expression, but others, however, purposely write poetry so that it is understandable.
We are faced with poetry everyday. Most often prose poetry, with only heightened imagery and emotional effect. When your husband says "i love you" , it is certainly pleasant to hear, but why, how much, in what ways, and so on. There are so many words and so many ways to organize them to say what you truly feel in the best way possible. Some people have the ability to do so while others aren't so creative.
I've had some amazing experience with poetry, whereas someone close to me will write for me. Most of the poems are enlightening and tell of how much they love me and so on. It is truly wonderful.
SAVE POETRY!
I must say that I agree with everyone else, in which poetry should still be taught in English classrooms. Just like ro ro and Daniel said, I think that poetry is in fact one of the most important topics at school because it is something that we connect and can relate to. We read it and interpret it the way we want to and then see if we could relate to it. Just like music, it is something I can connect to and express and reveal my feelings.
I believe poetry is worth teaching in high school English classrooms because it helps student develop more knowledge on analyzing text. Not only that but it also teaches students how to use context to understand the meaning of words. But overall it teaches us how the writer feels about certain topics.
This is Ted Nowak
I am surprised at how many of you think poetry is actually worth teaching. You guys are all ridiculous.
In my opinion, poetry is a dying art...and it's been dying for quite a long time. Poetry in my opinion should not be something that is naturally taught in schools anymore, but something that is taught as a sort of elective. Poetry is increasingly losing value in society. People are just not appreciating it as much as before.
When I was in 6th grade, I wrote a poem for a girl that I liked. It was a real nice poem I swear, it rhymed and everything. Real sweet aren't I? Real clever aren't I? NO! Not at all. She thought it was the corniest thing in the world, she told all her friends about it, and I was laughed at for a decent amount of the year. I know what you're gonna say, "it was 6th grade!" Naw man, forget that. Poetry is not appreciated as much as before. Not many people will write poetry anymore.
The poetry that I hear today! I firmly believe that it sucks...like...real bad. I don't like it. If I had to pick some poetry, I'd pick some poetry from back in the day. But it's no longer back in the day...it's TODAY and we don't get decent poems like way back when. I don't like the way poetry has evolved and I don't think other people like it either. DUDE, I'm ranting.
I have to admit that there are times I read poetry and I say to myself..."Yeah man...for real, that's how I'm feeling." (to which I agree with ro ro) But I think I'd get the same thing out of something written in prose. Who needs symbolism and mysticism when only a small percentage of us can understand it. Furthermore, poetry analysis and text analysis are two different things. Just because you are good at analyzing poems doesn't mean you will be good at analyzing books. So I don't think you can use it to practice your analysis skills. (in response to Alexandra)
Some people might make the argument that there are some things that only poetry can express. But no, that isn't true. Poetry is just words. If you can express something in a poem (made up of WORDS), then you can express it in a regular sentence or paragraph too.
Can someone offer me something more convincing rather just repeat the same argument that poetry teaches analysis skills, teaches a different way of writing, blah blah blah. The only reason you should teach poetry, is if someone has an interest in it. It should NOT be a mandatory thing to be taught in schools.
EXPLOSION!
HELLO!?
A POEM ABOUT ANALYZING POETRY
Ahem…let’s not waste our time.
I had no idea that people have been discussing this, but I’m glad that they are. Poetry has been bothering me for the last few years. I never noticed how annoying it was until I was forced to read it.
Obviously, at this point, it’s easiest to support the teaching of poetry because that’s been going on for so long. Teachers have been giving us poems on subjects that we often do not understand and telling us to figure it out. Sure, it’s possible for us to get some understanding of these poems, but we are usually missing important pieces of information because a lot of these poems were written before the sun came into existence (obvious exaggeration). I’m willing to bet that there are some things in some of these poems that even our teachers don’t understand fully, and that’s fine, but they shouldn’t try to make us figure it out.
For AP exams, we’ve been taught to skip over things that we do not understand, but in doing that, we are skipping over something that was put in there for a reason. The poem is not complete without it. Therefore, our understanding is not complete.
I have found throughout the years that poetry portrays messages just like prose only in a twisted and complex way. In life, when people aren’t straightforward, it is annoying. You don’t want to be wasting your time trying to figure out what someone has to tell you.
I didn’t mind poetry when I was little. It was all nursery rhymes and such (Good old Shel Silverstein). Sure I didn’t understand them, but I didn’t have to, and they rhymed, so I was happy. Later I found out that poems didn’t have to rhyme, and I was devastated. So, I had to find a deeper meaning. I had to try and pinpoint what was going on inside one of these crazy people’s heads as they threw up rhythm onto a piece of paper. They’re loaded with metaphors comparing unrelated things and allusions to what I’ve never even heard of, and I have to waste my time researching it all.
I can remember many times last year where I would spend hours analyzing a poem line by line, defining word after word and stretching my brain to realize how little each of them made sense. Eventually, I might understand each line, but understanding the poem as a whole was an even bigger challenge. I specifically remember a poem called “Spider.” We analyzed it for a few days, on our own and in class; it still made no sense. Ms. Spachman ended up taking that poem off of the Internal Assessment list because it was too complex for us or something. The point is that it was a huge waste of time.
I agree with Ted when he says that Poetry should be taught as an elective. Certainly it does not belong in English classes, at least not if you are trying to teach good grammar. It’s almost hypocritical. Poetry thinks it has the right to break the rules of grammar. What makes it so special? I will say that poetry is an art, and I understand why people would like it, but we don’t need it in our English classes because it’s often like analyzing something that’s not even in English. Think of that poem in Chinese that Ms. Levine gave us. That’s really how a lot of poetry seems. Sure, we can translate it, but it won’t be 100% translatable, and what exactly is the point if we are not getting their message entirely?
Jayanta Mahapatra has it all backwards. Poets have a tendency to take simple occurrences and make them confusing. That may make sense to them, but not to everyone.
Here today, I say we riot against poetry, although clearly I won’t have much support. It’s time that poetry takes its rightful place next to Shakespeare.
Poetry? DEAD!
Unfortunately, its eulogy will not rhyme.
-Spencer Harstead
I believe that poety is worth teaching in high school. It just shows a different approach to interpreting an experience of an author. Novels and short stories are great, but sometimes there is a lot more meaning to something in fewer words. Poems can have the ability to move you and open your mind up to new things and new doors. Poetry has less rules than the usual writing, making it very individualistic. Sometimes, less words can mean so much more than many. Math and science we already know are set in stone; they can open our minds but only to a certain extent. Reading poetry can make our minds work in ways we didn't even know we could and open them up to endless possibilities.
Hello, this is Yesica Prado. :] 3rd Period yeah! xD
Although I would have to agree with Ted Nowak to a certain point, I would have to dismiss his concept that poetry is a dying art. It’s not. My dear friend, yes I will agree that poetry today is not as wonderful as it used to be, and people do not appreciate the beauty of words anymore. But if English teachers were to stop teaching poetry in schools then it would be forever lost in this inconsiderate world.
I don’t believe poetry consists of made up words. They are real words. Words with power. Emotion. History. While many people suggest that poetry has no meaning, it is due to the fact that is only meant for a certain audience. Just because you don’t get it that does not mean poetry should be destroy.
Poetry could also be compared to a painting. For example, why do we still keep old paintings in a museum? The painters are dead. Many of those paintings really do not make any sense. There are many paintings, which could not be really depicted as “beautiful,” but we still exposed them to the people. But why? Just as poetry, they are there to give us a sense of who we were, who we should be and who we want to be. If we weren’t to have it in our lives then we wouldn’t know where we stand in this world.
Also, today’s poetry could be best described as “it sucks,” however, there are still a few poets out there that have talent (Ashley! ^-^). A reason to why poetry sucks now days could be because many people use poetry for ranting rather than expressing a more positive or uncomplaining message. We hear that our government, society and love suck everyday; therefore, I don’t think it is really necessary for us to express it with all these symbols and metaphors that are just difficult to define. Yet, we still find ourselves longing for people who are willing to take a stand and convey that message into pleasing words, which we are all able to appreciate.
I think one of the most crucial things is that whether we like poetry or not, we need it. It is here not to teach us how to analyze better (which I strongly agree with Ted), but to teach us a moral value. Since many people dislike poetry, the moral values in our society have been lost throughout the years. If we get rid of poetry, in the end, there’ll be nothing significant left of the human race.
In response to Spencer, is not so much that poetry is special that it gets to break grammar rules but I think it’s meant to be that way in order to enhance the feeling of mankind’s imperfection. Yes, there are rules that we must follow but really who follows every single rule? It would be boring for everything to be neatly and perfect! I think the way poetry is structure, it gives words power and a new meaning than the way in which writing it is typically structured. Poetry is all about thinking outside the box. It has a soul. I like it. :]
In conclusion, all I’m saying is that poetry it’s a rare beauty and just because is so strange and misunderstood, it should be wiped out of existence. It must stay. Let us all preserve one of the greatest treasures in literature: poetry. ^-^
P.S. Ted, a good argument does not get too personal. Also, people are not ridiculous just because they have a different point of view. By the way, poetry does not necessarily need to rhyme. Peace man! :]
(Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe our friend Ted is the Holden Caulfield of the 21st century. ^.^ )
Right, I guess it is time for me to jump on the bandwagon in support for the argument that poetry should not be taught in English classes. BUT I WON’T!
I’ve read every single one of the entries that was posted on this blog as of now. I must say, there was very interesting arguments brought up; some more than others. Although most of the entries are for the teaching of poetry in English classrooms, there are a select few that are against it. At this point, I do believe that it is rather difficult to argue against the teaching poetry since it’s been the norm for so long. It is, and I am not arguing that. But I honestly believe that poetry should be taught in English classrooms and I will get to my rationale a little bit later.
I, myself, am not a poet, nor do I read poetry often. But, when I am required to read poetry I tend to ask the question “WTF?” Many of you will agree with me on that one as well. However, I do understand how necessary poetry is. We dislike poetry because of the complexity of the ideas and how they are organized. Let’s not argue that. But, to say that it is completely useless and a waste of time is just absurd. To Spencer, life is not as straight forward as you might believe it to be. Life is full of complex ideas as well as many different types of people. We as individuals all have different ways of expressing our beliefs and ideas into various forms of art in one way or the other. It would be rather boring if there was no challenge in life at all. Same goes with people. Some might believe that being straight forward is great and saves trouble. But, imagine life without something making sarcastic remarks or having something ironic. It would be pretty boring, right? Well, same goes for poetry. If all poetry is as easy as the nursery rhymes we are so accustomed to, it wouldn’t exactly be interesting.
In my lifetime, I have read many poems that I have considered to be terrible and some that was simply incredible. Through those experiences, I can see how some poetry is a complete waste of time to analyze. But to categorize great works of various poets and something a teenager wrote in their basement about their girlfriends/significant other is just not right (Sorry Ted). You see, those stupid poems that are written by over-emotional teenagers are a waste of time to read. Although, not saying that there aren’t any that are good. I’m just saying that poetry written by more refined minds is more beneficial to us. Perhaps it is because I am really tired right now, but I have noticed that my argument has been a little off topic. Bear with me here.
To say that poetry is completely useless and should be taken out of English classrooms is ridiculous. Just because something is challenging, or annoying we shouldn’t consider it useless or a waste of time. To be blunt, most of the stuff that we learn isn’t exactly going to benefit us in our future careers but we learn it anyways. Not because we learn it to waste time, but to develop a greater understanding behind it. Same goes for poetry. Poetry helps us understand the complexity of life and many ideas within. Reading poetry gives us a perspective on how others view the world, and that is not necessarily a bad thing. Not to get all philosophical, but poetry, like many prose, gives us a worldview of others in which we cannot see without it. Also, Spencer gave us a rather crude example of how useless poetry is. He stated that Ms. Levine gave us a poem in Chinese and that it is impossible to get the message entirely. However, I do believe that the poem was given out as a type of extra credit. Also, being taught about poetry and reading poetry exposes us to different ideas and thereby leads us to be well-rounded in terms of literature.
Well my argument was rather long and all over the place, but I hope I got my message across. Ted, I thought Najelly’s attempt was hilarious not below poor. Hope you enjoyed my long and boring rant.
Cheers, Jimmy.
Spencer, I enjoyed your post so much that I read it twice. I was also devastated when I found out poems didn't have to rhyme...it bothers me to this very day.
Yesica, I never meant to convey the message that poetry should stop being taught. Only that it should not be a mandatory subject to learn in high school English classes. To me, poetry is on the same level as finger painting, really fun and nice...but not necessary to teach to our high school students.
"If we get rid of poetry, in the end, there’ll be nothing significant left of the human race." Now this is a bigger exaggeration then Spencer's "before the sun came into existence." I'm not up for destroying poetry, but I'm sure us humans would not become insignificant after losing poetry. THAT is ridiculous.
I don't know who Holden Caulfield is and I don't know if it was meant as a clever insult or a discrete compliment. "Our friend Ted" is not your friend because he does not agree with you and he does not know you. I'd have to say that your love for poetry is making you bias in this argument since you think that mankind will lose all significance without poetry.
Jimmy, life IS complicated. But why the hell are you going to explain complicated life with complicated poetry? You're adding unnecessary work to your life. When people analyze poems and explain them, do they explain them in a poetic form? NO, THEY DON'T! They speak in sentences and paragraphs. There's no symbolism and no metaphors. It's a regular explanation. I get the same ideas and thematic concepts that you did, but it was through simple words.
Will you all just look at poetry for what it really is. It's really nice...I like poetry, I really do. But it is not necessary in high school English class rooms.
"If we get rid of poetry, in the end, there’ll be nothing significant left of the human race." Yes, it was meant to be an exaggeration because basically what I’m trying to say is that without poetry, we would lose a way to communicate our feelings without having to be ranting to the top of our lungs or be involved in any kind of violent act. Poetry is a way to express our repressed feelings, and is able to unite many readers through words. If we stop teaching poetry to students, the art of poetry will just keep being unappreciated and eventually forgotten. Therefore, poetry shouldn’t be an elective. It is necessary in our curriculum. That way, we can all benefit from a well educated and tolerant society. ^-^
Also, I used the words “our friend” in order to refer to you Ted because I was just being polite. O.o Yes, I don’t know you but that doesn’t I was going to disrespect you. If it really bothers you then I apologize. :]
Oh, the “Holden Caulfield” thing wasn’t meant for it to be an insult. He’s a character from a book called “The Catcher in the Rye,” which was written in the 1950’s and I don’t know if you read it during your sophomore year. I just thought it was really interesting how your diction and Holden’s diction was really similar. It’s just something that I wanted to say, so there’s nothing for you to worry about. ^-^
Justyna Here - 3rd period AP English
To express what I think on the subject of poetry, I feel that it shouldn't be a mandatory subject taught in schools. Like, Ted and Spencer said it should be only and elective. I don't think that poetry is any better than any other work and it doesn't really teach us more than the other books, texts, etc. It's still the same thing: we read a text and have to take the next few minutes(sometimes hours) to figure out the meaning beyond the words(which sometimes tends to drive me crazy, but that's just me :) Sometimes, through poems we can relate to ourselves based on what the author writes about and we find some meaning in it. I think that there is no point in enigma because it make us even more confused and lost when reading a text. Based on the poems we've read in class, I have mixed emotions as far as poetry. Some of the poems that we've read are at least easier to understand so it's easier to analyze them, which makes me like poetry a little more and find some sense in it, while others are written in such a way that (like some other people may say we) we go: "wtf??!!" We simply don't get it, which makes us frustrated and want to be done with poetry altogether!! I can say that peotry isn't all that important ot be taught in classrooms, but I have respect for those that think otherwise.
To answer some of the questions in this blog entry, I have to say that everyone is different when it somes to poetry. Some love it, some hate it. Teachers teach poetry maybe because they feel it hase value or just because they have to. Poetry can play a role in our lives in that to some poems we can relate to or find inspiration in them to write our own. Poetry may differ from prose in that it's more complicated and authors put more thought and effort into writing poetry. This difference matters in how we read the texts; of course we want to read something that is well written, has meaning and some sort of value to us compared to something that does not. Like I said before, with reading the latest poems, I've had my "good and bad days"; it's all based on the poem and how it's written. The worst poems as in the hardest to interpret were the ones from the our packet like "My Last Dutchess" or "somewhere i have never travelled, gladly beyond" and "A Valediction: Forbidding Mourning". Other poems were more pleasent like "True Love", "Recuerdo", "Early in the Morning", or "First Love". I come to a conclusion that every poem is different and ever person's interpretation of that poem varies.
When it comes to Lawrence Raab, I have to agree with RoRo when she says that "a poem is simply what we, the reader, make it. We apply our personal experiences to our readings and interpret the poem how we want, not as the poet intended".
Finally, to respond to some of what Ted and Spencer said. I think that they have a rather radical approach to poetry, which isn't a bad thing because alot of what they say is very true. (Here I may be repaeting what I've already said.) Poetry may be losing value in today's world. Poetry is just words arranged to sound pretty; same message can be expressed in a different way, put into slightly different terms. Poetry also shouldn't be thrown on us in school as something that is mandatory because not all of us care for poems or know how to analyze it to make sense. Like Spencer, I sometimes feel that we're given these poems and expected to understand their meaning among some of the advanced words that we don't even know the meaning of. It's true that it's been suggested to skip parts of a poem on the AP exam, but in doing that we may be missing and important point that may be asked about in a question later on. What do we do THEN??? And yeah, it's true...we sometimes spend hours on a poem, stretching our brain to find the meaning beyond the words and ask ourselves so many questions. In the end, we don't really get the poem anyways and find that our work was just a big loss of time. Maybe poetry and it's analysis really is pointless?? That's how I sometimes feel. How is poetry and it's analysis going to be helful in our lives? Does it teach us anything at all?
As far as poetry and it's funeral..I guess we have to wait and see. But I think that the ones that would be there to see it go would be people who love poetry, find meaning in it and so on and so forth, while others simply wouldn't care ;) Where am I among those people? I'd have to say somewhere in the middle, but I honestly have to say I wouldn't necessarily make the effort to find the time to go to that funeral....and that's that ;)
I completely agree with Roro, Lyric, and Lawrence Raab. Poetry will never be a simply piece of literature we can read and see the point within a instant. It is made up of words and phrases that doesn't always offer us a clear worldview and a understanding of the author's view of one thing or another. The one thing poetry can guarantee though, is the constant use of our brains. When we read poetry we have to look at it from all angles, we can't always tackle it in a straight line, we have to create other ways and come at it in other directions. Poetry is not a cruel invention created by teachers and AP officials so make our classroom lives a living hell. It's never easy, but we learn something within all that hair pulling and all those "wtfs" ,that leave our mouths, it opens up our minds and imaginations. Also, it opens a new world of literature to us. One that isn't dictated by grammar and sometimes even sense (if you don't believe me look at e.e. cumming. I mean what other type of literature will allow us not to capitalize, or even use periods?). So, it is 100% worth teaching. Like Rabb says, "You decide, says the poet.You do some of this work,
but think carefully."
Erica Castillo
3rd Period
If I had to pick right now should poetry be in high school English classroom, I would say no. In my life I seen poetry never helping me. When trying to write a cute poem people see no point. Most people want the truth. They do not want a long paper say how you feel. If you have something to say just say it. Like now for homework my sister laughs at me for try to write about the guy I like. She said to just tell him no need to write it out. I agree with her. NO POINT. I do agree with Ted Nowak.
However, poetry can be good for some people. I’ am not one of the people who can learn from poetry I learn better from the text. I agree with Ted when he said people think that analyzing poems can also make them better at analyzing novels/book/texts. They are two different things. But if you think you can learn that way. GO AND LEARN THAT WAY BUT DON'T MAKE ME LEARN THAT WAY.
I never did understand poetry. In class I will turn to the next person and ask "Do you understand it?" My first though would be "Oh God I hate this!" but if I read it again I do understand the poem but there is no point. I understand that some students love poetry so yes they should have a class or after school club for poetry BUT it should not be mandatory to be in a class. Poetry would be useful only if I was alive 100 years ago.
Poems now are so easy. Everyone says the same thing but in different words. Please lets write about something different.
However I do agree with this from Jayanta Mahapatra when said "Poets are expected to make sense of life" People now expected that poets know everything about life. No! that is not true we make the poems out of our own life. People now spin the words around so they can fit into their life. Also, I agree with Lawrence Raab when we make the poem from our own personal experience. We don’t see what the author wants us to see. We see what we want to see. So if you are an a bad mood you will see the poem in a gloomy world. If you are in a good mood you will see the poem in happy world.
Poetry is about to die and when it is dead I will not be at the funeral I will celebrating the death.
I'm sorry if I made anyone mad in the class, I know we have poets in my class.
I agree with Ted that everyone is, in fact, going off topic. I see here how most of those who are in support for the teaching of poetry in English classrooms will go on to describe what poetry is. However, none of you are really talking about if it is necessary to be taught. Just wanted to put it out there.
I agree with both Alexandra and Desiree, that poetry should be taught in schools. It helps us widen our imagination and we gain skill on how to interpret texts in different ways. As Lawrence Raab says in his poem, people interpret and understand things in different ways and with different ideas. Poetry helps us become able to connect to and understand other peoples thoughts and ideas. From reading poetry in English class, i have learned how to relate to a writer's ideas and perspectives with my own ideas. I have also learned how analyzing a poem thoroughly can widen my understanding of a text rather than just reading it once. The chinese poem that was included in our love poem packet was a poem that i really connected to. I believe that love is brought by fate. This is one of the many poems that has made me realize how every poem has some sort of connection to us. It all depends on how we interpret a text. Doing this makes us use our imagination more, which is helpful for college level stories, books, etc.
OK, I am going to begin responding to the two excepts. When the writer compared poems to birds, I actually agree with the statement that poems do not have an actual end. This is true for most parts of literature. Isn't that part of literary analysis to see what they mean and to discuss your interpretation on how is should end? Also, The quote about how poems are written to fix how we live is very interesting. I never thought about poems actually expressing how we feel at that moment in time. This is also true for every other type of literature. Look at music. Music defines the generation that is living at that time. Also, there are some artists, like the Dixie Chicks in response to George Bush, write about an event that occurred to them that they don't agree. However, poems are sometimes necessary even if I don't like them but not to the point where it can be overbearingly taught. Like music, literature has different genres of music and all of them are necessary.
Also, I agree with Ted on how poetry is increasingly becoming less important.
PS: Do student really have the power to stop allowing subjects to be taught in class???
Kyle Anthony
Ted Nowak
I'd like to thank everyone out there throwing me some support :D
When I was a child, I believed that poetry wasn’t a big deal in my life. But as I grew older, I realized that poetry had a key role in English, music, and of course love. From experience, in English class it is nice to read to the short or long stories. Although these types of stories help us to expand our mind I feel that poetry is the one thing in English that really makes us think about life and how we see different situations. Poetry seems to also help when people are trying to explain something, they want to make it short sweet and to the point and that’s what poetry helps us to do sometimes. Also, poetry is used in the music we listen to today. Just like poetry musical lyrics are broken up into verses. If the instrumental background music is taking from a song you are left with just the artist of the song saying a poem at a very fast pace. After examining all the ways tat poetry is used in life I would have to say that poetry is any but dead.
I also agree with others of poetry as an innovative aspsect of approaching life at its best. Poetry focuses on different point of views and tones of every day life. Poetry releases our utter emotions, enhancing our metaphoric grammar. With this type of literature, we gain our knowledge on all types of literary terms, metaphors, similies, etc. On the first text, I interpreted it as breaking the old approach of literature, highlighting the freedom in weaving an amazing piece of poetry. Similarly, for Lawrence Raab's poem I agree with Ro Ro about poetry being what you take in, the way a single word can have millions of interpretations.
I find it interesting that it is English teacher who fight about the importance and necessity of teaching poetry rather than the students. I think the importance of poetry has been said time and time again by everyone in the blog. Poetry teaches us how to analyze text in a different manner looking for the deeper meaning. I believe poetry to be more meaningful than a larger piece of text because most of the time the poets write only a small amount of words and conveys very large amount of interpretations. A poem can make you laugh,become sad or in love with very little words. On the other hand a stories do do the same thing but with a lot more words. I think poetry is much more efficient and for that reason meaningful
I agree with Jasmin and everyone else that says that poetry should be taught in English classes. As much as I don’t like working on poetry in my English class, I have to say that in a way, we do need it. It makes us become better at analyzing a text and become better readers. Poetry can help us widen our understanding of it and other texts. We have to find the meaning in it. I know that some people have said before that if something has meaning, why not just get to the point? We have to understand that not everything is going to be given to us directly. I think that this is one of the reasons why we learn about poetry in English classes. Poetry has much more meaning and can have a strong impact on others. However, I also have to agree with Spencer that sometimes we won’t understand a poem no matter how much we analyze it. We might not like that specific poem, but that doesn’t mean all poetry is the same.
This is Anali N., 2nd Period
Benjamin Barajas 2nd Period
First of I would like to say that every argument here is valid and quite entertaining. However I would like to say that to someone like Ted or Spencer that find poetry to be outdated or unnecessary to think about this for a second. I agree with you Ted that Science is an important part of our everyday life. However we cannot go on with out saying that speech, words,and writings are not just as important. Poetry is simply, another way of writing.
Mr. Crone would be looked at as a fool if he talked about centripetal forces without talking about Newton's laws wouldn’t he? These are both important to Physics. Just like prose writing and poetry co-exist and therefore must be taught together. Even if the lecture on poems is short it still has to be acknowledged.
I agree that poetry should be able to be taken as an elective. However as I said earlier a small introduction should be made to it in any English class. It is fundamentally a different WRITING style, and as being such should be given just as much respect as short stories and even longer chapter books.
I think what we are looking at here is something more than just poetry's necessity coming under question. We live in a world of technology and images. Why should anyone read a book if we can see the same basic story in a two and half hour movie? I think that it is no longer the pen is mightier than the sword, but the Camera is mightier than the A-bomb.
We must take into question, what has happened to our society when such a wondrous thing, like poetry is seen as dispensable. An as for Ted saying that it’s just not the good old days of poetry. I suggest such people like Sherman Alexie, Nikki Giovanni, and Pablo Neruda. While I know that these people are older they are all 20th and 21st century Poets. As for me I have always been inspired by poetry such as “Nothing Gold can stay” by Robert Frost or “The First Indian on the Moon” by Sherman Alexie.
Nature's first green is gold,
Her hardest hue to hold.
Her early leaf's a flower;
But only so an hour.
Then the leaf subsides to leaf.
So Eden sank to grief,
So dawn goes down to day.
Nothing gold can stay.
“Nothing Gold Can Stay” By Robert Frost
Ironically enough I will use a quote from a movie to make my last point. It’s from “Dead Poet’s Society”--- We don't read and write poetry because it's cute. We read and write poetry because we are members of the human race. And the human race is filled with passion. And medicine, law, business, engineering, these are noble pursuits and necessary to sustain life. But poetry, beauty, romance, love, these are what we stay alive for.
This is what i stay alive for...(sorry Ms. Levine i know you said never to do the... thing. Sorry.)
This is Stephanie Hernandez.
Like what many others said, I also believe that poetry is worth teaching to high school English students. Like JoAnna mentioned, poetry doesn't only teach different methods of analyzing the text found in poems and offer students different techniques but I believe that poetry also allows a worldview to be presented to the reader in a different method. I think that poetry is able to send the reader a message giving a different, more emotional mood than otherwise given with a text. I also believe that poetry is used many times as a way of expressing feelings less formally than it would in a novel, for example.
I don't agree with the quote that "poets are expected to make sense of life" said by Jayanta Mahapatra because I don't believe that poets always have an answer for something. I tend to agree more with Lawrence Raab that many times poets tend to ask questions for them meant to remain unanswered. I believe this because I think that many times poetry is written in order to express a feeling or questions that a person might feel within themselves.
Personally in my opinion, I believe that poetry should still be taught to high school English classrooms. I agree with ro ro on the subject that poetry is what makes the interaction with other authors words inspirational. We look at many different types of literature that best suits us with our life experiences.
Not everybody is going to cope with poetry and its aspects but it'll certaintly create a different interpretation on the readers. We'll look at a poem and try to understand it to see if we agree with it or not. What's amazing about literature is that it's open to interpretation as long as it's proven with evidence the argument is reliable.
The same goes for poetry as long as whatever your mind interprets it, the message will come across, just like Lawrence Raab states. Teaching poetry doesn't hurt anyone and I believe it's not a waste a time; it is just who actually pays attention and puts it to heart.
I personally enjoy poetry. There are some poems that I'm like what? but overall there are some that really leave me think and actually have a connection to my life experiences. I wouldn't put it to the side, but i would put it as an option.
-Miriam Orrego
Diana Arechar 2nd Period
Poetry may not always appeal to us, and we might not always be able to make sense of it. I still find it important to continue teaching poetry in a high school English classroom. Our English teachers try to make the students see beyond what is read. We analyze the meaning to each phrase, and in turn, can come to our own conclusions about the message behind each poem. It isn’t always meant to be simple because looking deeper into a text and understanding it helps us understand other types of literature. There are even poems that we can say are similar to our everyday lives.
Some people can say they agree with the views a particular love poem while another person opposes that view on love. Poems are structured differently from prose. Prose is structured in more of a paragraph form while poems are structured in stanzas. The difference matters because the structure of a poem, with its ability to break off into a new stanza when it wishes the shift to change, “invokes a feeling within people that typical literature cannot” as Ashley Hart said.
When I encounter a new poem, I know that I might not like it. Sometimes, even though I don’t agree with the worldview of a poem, I find the form and expression beautiful. I learn to appreciate even the things I don’t encounter everyday. Poems can even help us understand aspects of life because it shows us a perspective we never bothered to look through before. For this reason, I find the quote from Mahapatra to be true. Poets write poetry to express themselves and even to make sense of their lives. Raab wrote “Some people want to believe/ poetry is anything/ they happen to feel.” I agree with this statement and go on to say that poetry can also be something more; something that cant always be explained by emotions but by the complicated way the poet structured it. For these reasons, I disagree with Spencer and his statement that poetry doesn’t belong in an English class.
Personally, I think that poetry has not lost any of its significance. Yet, I agree that it should be taught as an elective but still be reviewed in regular English classes. With a constantly changing world it’s easy to understand why people would rather opt out on poetry. There are so many other things to be done now days it’s hard for a lot of people to actually take the time to analyze poetry and really become involved in it. But even then, poetry cannot simply be ignored. Poetry has played such an important role in Literature that it should at least be reviewed in regular Literature classes. Even if we realize it our not there is always something we do or see in our daily life that is somehow connected to poetry. Don’t you like listening to music? Not one of us can say that we have never looked up the lyrics to a song.
For those of us who have Mr.Penuelas: I’m sure we’ve all seen the video “Faces of World War 1 - The Ones who've seen Horror”. A poem that I believe is a good companion to the video is “Dulce et Decorum Est” by Wilfred Owen. Learning how poetry works is actually an advantage when it comes to analyzing other aspects of life.
---Daniela Godinez
I think this may be one of the most intense blogs I have read.
Initially, i was going to argue that poetry should be taught in high school, but i think my opinion has changed. I think that "teaching" poetry ruins it. For all those who said it teaches different methods of analyzing, it really doesnt. Just because a one poem is written differently than another does not mean there is some new form of analysis invented to try and figure out what is going on in the poem.
Poetry is dying, and i think teaching it is helping kill it. Poetry is meant for expression just like art is. It is way more expressive than any pros because their is no barriers on it. I wouldnt read a book that doesnt have correct punctuation or enjambment becuase thats just ridiculus, but it works in a poem. We dont have a class that forces us to analyze works of art so that we can later answer ridiculously hard questions about it for a reason. I think poetry is meant to be enjoyed by the individual. If you dont like poetry, dont read it. Same goes for art. If you dont like a paiting, dont look at it.
I would also disagree with ro ro. A poem is not what we make it. No literary work is what a person makes out of it. The author or poet has a purpose for writing what he or she writes and i doubt that the reason is so the a reader can read the work and think what he or she wants to about it with seeing what is actually meant to be understood.
So, in conlusion, we should stop being "tought" poetry. If a person likes poetry, they should read it on their own time because im really tired about hearing people totally butcher a poem by completelying twisting it meaning. Some people just dont get it, and thats whats killing poetry.
(p.s. The poem that was read at Obama's inagguration (s/p) was the worst thing i ever heard! The lady who wrote it singly handedly stabbed poetry in the face)
Robert Slay
WOW, I just read many of the responses on this blog. I agree with most of the people here in saying that, poetry should be taught in high school. While at the same time, it shouldn't be focused on entirely. When I think of poetry, i think of a murder. Poetry doesn't have the crime scene or none of the evidence. Regular literature has the murder victim, crime scene and murder weapon. Basically what I'm saying is that poetry makes it harder for you to develop a argument because you have little context to base it off of. Poetry should be taught partly in high school as a way of expression or method of expressing underlying messages. I understand where Ted is coming from but, I have to say that he is biased because he had a bad experience with poetry, which makes him not like it as much as he probably would have if he didn't have that bad experience. Also with our current poetry assignments in class, I do get frustrated with them but, its all apart of the poetic world. Poetry should be taught in school because of its challenging and unknown, sometimes underlying meanings that captivate your audience in a unique and different way.
I believe like so many people on this blog, that poetry does in fact matter. While, this opinion is overstated, and mind numbingly agreed in unison by so many others (for some. Sorry ted). Again, I want to say that I love poetry for what it accomplishes. It does not always accomplish it in all people in the same way. Some people become annoyed by the mere fact that we are forced to learn about it in a classroom as a requirement. However, I do know that in order to understand literature, we are going to need to learn all forms. Not just one. Reading a book is simply not enough. It’s minimal, and we are just missing the picture of a broader subject. Literature isn’t by definition a book, nor poetry alone. Literature is the inspiration and all the forms of expression that come along with it. So Ted, while to you it may seem unnecessary, while the same thing could be accomplished in a paragraph or complete sentence, what is the point of acknowledging literature and what it also accomplishes to either invoke: feeling, compassion, hatred, happiness ect. if we don’t include poetry? Everything must at least be probed at in order to become more well rounded individuals. Poetry does in fact teach skills that I consider valuable, seeing as I can interpret a number of things from a single line than I can in a whole paragraph because of the manner it is written and words that are carefully chosen. Everything is just more precise when it comes to poetry, while it could lead to different outcomes for every individual reader, things are put there for a specific reason, and it is up to the reader to come to the conclusion. I think that Lawrence Raab is trying to say that poetry leads to questions, and questions are all beautiful things about learning. We would be no-where without looking for answers, we as people are always looking for answers and sometimes its just best to leave things as is. Why ruin another extension of expression just because it isn’t considered necessary by some? Why not give people a chance to decide and make what they want with poetry and literature. Nothing is ever truly set, which is something wonderful about literature in general and the people that write it. I hope this had made more sense…
Erika Marquez
I'm going to have to agree with most of the people here who say that poetry is important. I think that it should still be taught in schools. I really believe that poetry is necessary because it teaches us a lot of things that are necessary when analyzing any type of text. I myself have learned how to better use a lot of different elements like tone, diction, mood, etc through poetry. I believe that we defenitely need poetry because as students it helps us become better analyzers. Sure some poems may be extremely difficult but that doesn't mean that we have to get rid of poetry completely. Poetry teaches us alot and although at times it doesn't relate much to what we are learning in our English classes, it's fun to put aside all the other things and learn something new. I believe that poetry is necessary and not completely useless because many times we can relate to what we're reading. Poetry is a form through which we can express ourselves. So not only does it help us get more knowledge but it's a way of expressing our feelings. I would defenitely attend poetry's funeral if it were to die. I don't think that it should be dismissed although I would have to agree with Spencer in the sense that sometimes no matter how many times we analyze a poem it still won't make sense. Still, just because something is difficult it doesn't mean that we should give up completely on that thing. I think that nowadays many believe that poetry is stupid because many poems are hard to understand but that's wrong. We should appreciate poetry because it is an extremely important thing.
Before I even make my own claim I would like to say that I agree with Ted on that poetry is a dying art, and just because you can analyze poems doesn't mean you can analyze books. I think poetry is worth teaching in a high school English classroom. Poetry stimulates the mind, academic growth, and creativity in individuals. It allows a student to express not only their feelings but convey a message by their own means. I also believe like Mr. Raab mentions in his poem "Some people want to believe poetry is anything
they happen to feel". The issue with poetry that sometimes you won't find in novels per say is that it's not always straight forward. You have to carefully analyze and pay attention to word choice, enjambment and techinques to understand the meaning of a poem.
Lania West
Ted Nowak
I'll give credit to all the people who were backing up their arguments that disagreed with me. But to all you people who think poetry is mandatory in the English classroom simply for the reason that YOU like it...you never came up with any GOOD reason for why poetry should be mandatory...you're all ridiculous.
OH HEY LOOK AT ME, I LIKE NUCLEAR PHYSICS! IT SHOULD BE A MANDATORY THING TO LEARN IN ALL SCIENCE CLASSES! See what I did there?
All I ask for is for someone to give me a GOOD reason for why poetry should be taught. Because it helps us analyze? Because it's mysterious? Because it's challenging? Because it's a pain in the ***? Once again everyone, I love poetry, I really do...I just don't think it should be forced into the ears of everyone.
I agree with most people that poetry should be taught in english classes because it is just another way to express our thoughts. I was never really into poetry and would get confused but I knew that there was always a special meaning behind it. Some poems are very sweet and humble and others are saddening, but every poet is expressing their worldviews upon society for us to get another point of veiw. Other point of views help us grow and learn as society and poetry is something that can capture our minds. Personally I never liked depressing poems about destruction and break ups and she did this or that, to me its too cliche. I'm into more of the magical, mystery and love topics of poems (even though love is cliche). Those can brighten my day instead of darkening it. I also agree with Lawrence Raab that its really what the reader makes of it because the poets are giving this to us for ourselves to have our own opinions. Poems are stories written in ways that capture our hearts as in "Dover Beach" or "True Love", sometimes they can figure out things we can't fully understand even in life.
This is yvette, and I want to say that I agree with most of you guys out there saying that poetry should still be taught in high school english classes. I like what Alexandra specifically said about poets:"They write so their emotions and idea can be embedded into the minds of other." It's true, that's how I feel about poetry, that it is made to be a piece of literature that is meant to linger in the minds of those who read it and to reveal a little of who the author is and their emotions.
But I have to disagree with those of you who say that it is only with poetry that certain techniques are possible, such as the use of enjambent. Ever read books like Crank,Burned,Speak, Better Than Running at Night? All of these books are novels that used a lyrical type of story-telling similar to that of prose poetry. Regardless of there being a standard way of writing a novel, the authors of these books had no trouble using literary techniques that are found in poetry.
So in conclusion, yes poetry should still be taught in the high school english classroom, because even though books such as these exist I believe that it would be easier to read through novels such as these if poetry is taught in the classroom. Plus poetry is always interesting to try to decipher.
Jamie Chan
I would like to argue that the learning of poems helps us realize more on how the people wrote in that era. Without learning how they wrote, we wouldn't know what techniques they used, what their responses were, and etc... BTW it doesn't hurt to learn more.
-Martin Arriaga
I agree with Benjamin that poetry is an important aspect in our lives, since poetry is just another form or writing. Coming into contact with both prose and poetry allows us to discover and interpret different ways of writing.
Although poetry is supposed to convey a certain mood or emotional effect on the reader, that feeling is not always expressed by the reader and sometimes does not truly portray what the poem’s message is. Poetry allows us to express certain words and phrases that help generate the message in our literature pieces. Being able to do this allows us to entrap our audience in amazement, laughter, or even sadness. Accomplishing this with poetry allows us to see the power that attracts the audience, which is created from just writing a small text that embraces our thoughts and past. Even though poetry should be taught to students as a way for them to experience a different style of writing, there are still flaws that render the writer to fully express the way they want their piece to be read.
During these times, poetry is not appreciated as much as before, which Ted clearly pointed out. The technology and the lack of having more free time during this century has rendered many to express their thoughts through poetry, compared to those who have created great pieces many years before us.
I see prose and poetry to be the same in the fact that they both try to convey a message to us. Prose directly explains what the message is while poetry takes time to look over and interpret its meaning. So really it is the way the writers structure their pieces to convey their ideas toward us.
The poetry that I have come into contact more is with the poet Edgar Allen Poe. Teachers repeatedly showed me many of his poems and I became accustomed to Poe’s way of poetry. I was very intrigued and mystified by his poetry. Even watching the Simpsons episode after reading the poem made me chuckle knowing that I knew what the Simpsons were trying to make fun of. Seeing the poetry on TV and being able to interpret both meanings, regardless being entertaining or boring, I felt that I was in on the joke that many wouldn’t understand. This gave me a great sense of satisfaction as a result of coming into contact with such poetry.
Oh and one more thing... We've been taught poetry in the english classroom for eons (exaggeration...or is it???) and there's a reason for that. Yes people like Ted, Spencer, Jimmy, and Nina seem to feel that it is no longer necessary but the reality is that you will always be outnumbered by the majority who does want to continue being taught this type of writing, so deal with it please. Frankly losing any type of artform is, I believe, very unenlightning. Everything that a person learns in the classroom will be useful at one point or another in their life, and I'm highly positive that you will end up taking one english class in college where you will have a crazy professor that will require you to analyze at least one poem in your college life. So just accept that whether or not you don't like the material, you still should learn it, besides it can't hurt to learn anything new. [And yes I'm disregarding all the complaints of everyone who says that poetry is annoying, stupid, lame, useless, gives you headaches, is not understandable, blah blah blah... because I could say the exact same thing about a million things like: my sophome art class, learning how to type on the keyboard properly, or learning my times tables in the second grade, etc, etc.)
Sorry Ted, although I would love to agree with you that poetry is a dying art, I can't! That's right, you heard me, I can't! Especially after participating in the Poetry Slam on Friday! I went there with a close mind that it was going to suck and I was wasting my time. Walking out 3 hours later, I had a completely different oppinion about poetry. Poetry is FULL of meaning, really it is!!!!
So I must say poetry is worth teaching in high school English classrooms. Poetry is hard and confusing at times, but sometimes a students we tend to make it harder by having a closed mind. If you approach poetry the right way (ex.downwhy...sympathy...connection to self)you will enjoy it and understand it so much more. Poetry reveals to students how you can express your uniquely by using different techniques. Yes, prose does too but the big difference is the rules and stucture. In poetry there are no rules for stucture, punctuation, etc. And that is why poetry is a MUST because you can 't get this experience with any other type of literature.
In conclusion, I agree with Lawrence Raab that everyone is entitled to there own interpretation of poetry---that is what makes poetry poetry, right!
Looks like there's blog drama in here. haha.
Poetry is unique in its own way. For me personally, teaching it in school can go either way. I mean one thing is teaching students about it, another is trying to deeply analyze it and squeeze a meaning out of it. Poetry is art, and art has an unlimited explanations. I mean some poems have a right there message, and others you have to deeply anaylze. Being said, when you analyze a poem there is no right or wrong answers. I believe people should read poem because they are wonderful art,but when someone tries to make me analyze it, it seems like it takes away meaning. The poem is the way it is, people shouldn't go around it and squeeze a story to it that might make no sense.
I want to share my favorite poem. It's really cheesy, but I love it. =]
Hug O' War
I will not play at tug o' war.
I'd rather play at hug o' war,
Where everyone hugs
Instead of tugs,
Where everyone giggles
And rolls on the rug,
Where everyone kisses,
And everyone grins,
And everyone cuddles,
And everyone wins.
All yeah...Ted, look up "LOUDER THAN A BOMB POETRY SLAM" the finals are coming up soon!!! I think you might enjoy it!!!! (laughing out loud)
I must say that this is the best blog ever!!!! lol xD
Magaly Franco.
I must agree with Ted and anyone else who believes that it isn’t necessary for poetry to be taught in schools as a mandatory class; poetry should be an elective for those who enjoy it or seek a future in it. If anything, there can be a mandatory brief introduction to it just so people can try it out and see if they like it, but only once and not repeated throughout our school years. In my opinion, poetry is completely pointless. In school, it should only be mandatory to teach us subjects that will help us in most future careers or in life in general. This leaves me to wonder: what does poetry help us in? Unless we’re seeking a job as a poet, there is no point in learning poetry. No job description, besides that of a writer and a literature teacher, requires people to understand poetry. Even so, that is a very limited amount of jobs that require it. Besides, what are the chances that any of the kids in a particular literature class will take either one of those jobs anyways?
My teachers have been teaching me how to analyze poetry all throughout high school, and, to this day, it hasn’t given me any new advantages in my life. I still perceive the world around me in the same way because poetry doesn’t teach me anything new. Like Lawrence Raab said himself, people interpret poetry by applying their own experience to it, which results in the readers not learning anything new because they are just relating it to what they already know. That just seems pointlessly redundant to me. If you’re looking for someone or something to relate to, you can just talk to a friend or a read in prose, which are probably more helpful because they’ll be more descriptive about their experience.
I completely agree with Ted that the same exact thing that people try to say through poetry can be said in prose. In fact, it can possibly even be said better. Prose can be more direct that poetry, so therefore if you use prose to make your statement, it is more likely that people will actually understand what you are talking about and not interpret completely different. For example, last year when we were analyzing poems, students would come up with completely different interpretations, but when we analyzed prose, our interpretation was more or less similar. If the writer is concerned about portraying emotion in his writing, he/she can still use different literary techniques in prose to convey that emotion while saying it in a way that is more direct and can’t be misinterpreted as badly.
Poetry doesn’t even play a part in my daily life unless my literature teacher decides to teach me about it, and I bet if you ask a lot of people if it affects their daily life outside of school, majority, if they are not writers, will say it has no impact at all. I have no interest in poetry, no plans of becoming a writer, and I haven’t been affected by it. I feel like learning about poetry is a complete waste of my time, in which I could be learning something that I actually like or will actually apply to my daily life or future.
Yvette,
It is rather obvious that you did not thoroughly read my entry. :)
Cesar S.
This is a literature class and I should sound like mostly everybody and say “ I believe poetry is worth teaching in school “. However, I agree with Ted and the girl who told him poetry was “the corniest thing in the world”. Poetry to me has always been useless. You find what the poet is trying to say, but at the end it does the same thing a piece of literature in prose would. It makes it a lot simple for people who don’t enjoy poetry. For people that do enjoy reading poetry they can take that as an elective. (another agreement with Ted) I read poetry because I have to in order to get credit. Then I forget poetry even exists. It doesn’t help me in order to know how to drive a car, how to use a computer, how to do math, how to create research and experiments, and I’m just going to stop here. Prose beats poetry. I rather be told something directly or read about something that is stated directly to try to understand the author. I have to say I dislike the author playing hard to get understood. To me it matters because it only makes it harder for people to communicate between each other. Some people might understand it, and others might not. I agree with ro ro that people do read poems to read about experiences, or people read for a connection. I don’t mind if people find this interesting through poems. I personally don’t find it interesting and rather read about experiences and find connection in prose. I disagree with Jayanta Mahapatra. Reading about different poets trying to make sense about life makes finding my own sense in life even more confusing. Any author can try to make their own sense in life in prose. I do agree with Lawrence Raab in that people “want to believe poetry is anything they happen to feel. That way they’re never wrong”. Does it really matter if they’re wrong or right? That means everybody is going to have different meanings, and it’s only going to cause discussions and confusion. In my opinion I believe poetry is dead.
This is Kyle Trentz.
I would like to start off by saying that I agree with Ted's argument 100%; poetry is unnecessary and should not be taught in high school classrooms anymore. His statement that poetry is a dying art and has been for a long time is something that I believe is also true. As i said in the last blog past about grammar, the world is continuously changing. I believe that also applies to this blog post.
Poetry is something that was invented hundreds of years ago, along with grammar. It was used as a way for people to express their ideas, emotions and many other things. However, I believe that now-a-days, poetry is only really used when it comes to love. As Ted said, he tried to write a poem for a girl when he was in the 6th grade, which is something I'm sure everyone has done in the past. If you were to ask someone to name a poet or the name of a piece of poetry, I', probably 100% certain that they would name either William Shakespeare or the title of a love poem. I think this shows that poetry is really dying and if it did, I would not attend its funeral.
Many people think negatively when it comes to poetry simply because that is not the way people talk or write anymore. As the world changes, so does the way in which we communicate and express ourselves. I believe that poetry was used as a way to do this, but hundreds of years ago; not anymore.
It may be good to know the basic ideas behind poetry in order to see different ways of writing and to see how writing styles have changed over the years, but other than that, I think it is completely useless.
Jessica Villarreal
I agree with Rocio when she says that we use poems to seek a connection. Throughout life, we are always looking for someone we can relate to. We try to find someone, or something, that brings us to a better understanding of ourselves or the world in general. Through poetry, I believe we are able to experience the world a different way by looking at it through someone else's eyes. We are able to investigate and discover new perspectives we hadn't known before and this brings us closer to knowledge. We can learn new things through poetry if we only take the time to really try to grasp what the author is trying to tell us. We can learn alot about the world through poetry, but we must be willing to look for the secret, or not so secret, message.
I also agree with Jayanta Mahapatra. She says that poets are expected to make sense of life. I completely agree because like I said before, people are always analyzing poetry and looking for meaning. If there is no meaning, then what's the point?
Personally, I have not been moved by poetry so far. I have had experiences with misinterpreting poetry too many times, and never have i found a poem to be so great to me. I do not like Sylvia Plath poems like "Stillborn" and I do not believe we should have spend so much time trying to figure it out in class last year. If poems are really what you interpret them, or want them to be, there should really be no point in cracking them down word by word. Instead of enjoying great literature, I feel like a detective. It is not the case for all poems, but most of the ones we do in class. I guess I am just not a poetry type of person and that is weird because I love the arts. However, I believe Rocio has a great argument of why we should teach it in class. To some individuals, poetry serves as a good comfort zone that allows us to find connections to feelings, and emotions. I think poetry should be taught in high schools, just so we are well rounded individuals and so we won't start going comma or punctuation crazy on a poem. (haha) I happen to like Lawrence Raab's poem just a tiny bit actually, but still didn't make all that sense to me. Good thing they are teaching me about poetry in class, so maybe I won't be as slow when it comes to poetry and I can possibly learn to appreciate it more than I do now. That way, I don't have to keep feeling like a detective.
In my opinion I enjoy reading poetry but only the one that I can relate to. When a piece of poetry is hard to read or has no connection with my life then it loses its meaning. I agree with Ted and Cesar that say poetry should be an elective. Poetry is beautiful in its own way, but if people don't get that connection then it is not going to mean anything at all. Now, times have changed and so has poetry. Even the fact that all my years of high school the topic of poetry was left for the end. Why? Because there's not that much to it. It's like a fun topic to do in order to take a break from analysis. Yeah you are still going to analyze it, but poetry takes the readers into so many worlds that's even harder for all of us to come to a conclusion.
I also agree with Rocio that poetry is more ellaborate than prose. I really enjoy poetry when I come across it. Whenever I read a poem I always look for lines or whole poems that have meaning to me. I may not like the whole poem but I sure may find interesting a line or two. i'm not saying poetry has no value in this society because that is not true. Poetry doesn't have to be just poems that people read they could be expressed throughout lyrics. I see more and more songwriters making millions of dollars to songs that only have about four to six words. When you put it in paper that becomes poetry. Poetry is still alive but it has taken different routes and new meanings.
I'm sorry, but I don't think I would go to the funeral.
Like what many others had said, yes, I do believe that poetry should be taught in school. Although not everyone can understand the whole meaning of why poetry was created, and some may never understand, but it's just a way to express feelings, thoughts, and ideas that brings your inner self out. Writing can be very expressive and sometimes it can reveal things that can't be verbally or could show people things that can't be said out loud. Not everyone can understand everyone's poem, but it allows everyone to see things in different perspective and learn more about each other as humans. Each line in each poem has it's own meaning and idea that the author's trying to make, and with that in thought, it only makes writing that much more meaningful. The past few days in class we have been reading love poems. I'll have to say I had some difficulty understanding some, but it's not something that I wouldn't want to learn and understand.
Oh, yes! After going to the poetry slam, it did make me see poems at a different angle! A positive one! It was a great experience and it made me see a much deeper meaning in poems.
I agree with those that said poetry should continue to be taught in the class rooms. I believe that poetry offers an opportunity to enhance our analytic skills to a higher degree. True, other short stories and novels can be analyzed, but most of the time they are straight forward. Poetry requires a person to take their thought process to another level and go way beyond what they see. For some students poetry can be an escape and allow them to let their inner thoughts out onto paper. Like Desiree said poetry even allows students to become very creative which is handy in the workplace. From personal experience once I sat down and actually analyzed a poem I was able to gain a lot of insight into this author’s ideas and their views on the world. I even took some of those ideas and made them my own. As far as poetry’s impact on the audience, there are some forms of poetry that even offer empowerment for example, “Phenomenal Woman” by Maya Angelou. Also, for those that said poetry isn’t as good as it was in the past they obviously didn’t go to the poetry slam.
I do believe that poetry is worth teaching in the classroom first and foremost because part of education is to become a well-rounded citizen. By introducing different aspects of literature into the classroom, a student becomes exposed to more than just the basics. Well-cultured and well-rounded individuals succeed in life. School is supposed to help in your success right? How can you be successful without being a well-rounded person? Even though we find analysis annoying, especially when we are in the last stretch before graduation, this helps us by exposing us to different worldviews. Poetry is included, in that, even though poetry is presented differently than a prose, it reveals worldviews. By exposing us to different aspects of life, we become better rounded people. I would sincerely disagree with Mahapatra's quote. Just because poetry is presented differently than prose, doesn't mean it should be respected differently. There are many different forms of art: sculpture, sketch, painting, etc., but all these different kinds are respected the same. The same should occur in literature. Just because poetry is a different form doesn't mean it's different. Poetry is an expression, just as prose can be. Raab's poem brought me to a realization that, with poetry being so complex to brake down and analyze, we are forced to exercize our brain in different ways than with prose. We are forced to become more creative in our analyzation and reading of poetry overall. With this new aspect of literature, we are enabled to notice more than the regular joe.
*face palm*
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